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#44735 - 24/01/09 07:03 PM Re: Change [Re: Mark Bradshaw]
Dr.BongoBingo Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/10/08
Posts: 46
Originally Posted By: Mark Bradshaw


I say "coloured" as opposed to "black" because he is of mixed parentage.


Mark...stop digging a bigger hole !

Would you describe somebody with a English father and a Greek mother as a coloured?

OK...I know that there is no "Boothism" within your use of the word.
But I'll give 100 to the charity of your choice if you ever hear anybody refer to Barak Obama as the US's first coloured President.

Dr.BB

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#44740 - 24/01/09 09:43 PM Re: Change [Re: ]
Harland Online   content
Full Member

Registered: 29/04/05
Posts: 1324
Loc: North Yorkshire
Originally Posted By: sea shore sam
what have I done nobody seems to want to talk to me!!?


.

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#44741 - 25/01/09 06:53 AM Re: Change [Re: Dr.BongoBingo]
Bliss 60 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/05/07
Posts: 273
Loc: Birmingham
It should be up to the person concerned to define their racial and ethnic background, because it is as much a part of their personal identity as religion or sexuality. If Obama calls himself black - then we should call him black. If he calls himself mixed race - then we should call him mixed race. As Dr BB says, I don't think its very likely that Obama will call himself coloured.

Discussing the use of words can seem a little politically correct, but actually these things can and do make a lot of difference to the people concerned. The word "coloured" has some horrendous connotations from America's past in the deep south, and so black people don't like to be called "coloured".

I was doing an equalities and diversity training session for an all white group once, who were a good group, but they hadn't come across discussions of that nature before. When suggesting to them that black people don't like to be called "coloured", one of the group said - round here there perfectly happy to be called "coloured". I continued to assert that this was not the case, and, against my advice, the person took it upon himself to go and ask a black man who happened to be in another room in the building about it. He came back about 5 minutes later saying that what I had said was correct - the black man had said that he was black - and he did not like to be called "coloured".

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#44742 - 25/01/09 09:13 AM Re: Change [Re: Bliss 60]
Lounge Lizard Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/05/06
Posts: 2013
Loc: Stafford
Yes, it's all about what group do or don't mind being called.
We don't mind Brits, Australians don't mind Aussies but Pakistanis do mind Paki and Blacks don't like Coloured.

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#44745 - 25/01/09 11:10 AM Re: Change [Re: Lounge Lizard]
fiffeshni Offline
Full Member

Registered: 24/01/09
Posts: 11
Loc: Sheffield
Someone has used the word coloured,what a big deal,as usual,the comment was misconstrued as being used in a negative way by the author when he was clearly praising Obama.
I have never been referred to as a coloured b****d in my life,but if someone refers to me as a coloured guy,why should I find that offensive? It surely depends on the intent in which the word used and not the word itself.
Come on guys,get a grip!

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#44746 - 25/01/09 11:33 AM Re: Change [Re: Lounge Lizard]
Bliss 60 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/05/07
Posts: 273
Loc: Birmingham
Originally Posted By: Lounge Lizard
Yes, it's all about what group do or don't mind being called.
We don't mind Brits, Australians don't mind Aussies but Pakistanis do mind Paki and Blacks don't like Coloured.


Sorry if people think I need to get a grip on this, but hey - I think this is an important issue. I don't for one minute think that Nimrod meant anything by the use of the word "coloured", and as far as I can tell, he's a good person who wouldn't mean to cause anyone offence. So my comments on the word were not particularly directed at him, but I do actually make a point of pointing out that the use of the word "coloured" can be offensive to some black people. I think that there are two reasons for this:

a) it was the word used by deeply racist people in the deep south of america when black people were being heavily oppressed.

b) saying that someone is "coloured" suggests that they have some "colour" added to what is the standard or normal skin colour - ie. in the minds of those who originated the phrase - the white skin (or as it should be - the pinky/yellow/red/brown skin with the odd freckle thrown in - who exactly is the "coloured" person?)

Similarly as Mr LL points out - "paki" is an offensive term, because it was and is used by racists to denigrate all people of south asian origin.

I guess that the terms Brit and Aussie are OK because they haven't been used in a derogatory fashion ever, although - whilst I'm not going to make a meal of it - I probably would do a double take if someone called me a Brit - because I'd be worried that it's main usage might be something like "Brits abroad" - ie. the seemingly large body of people from our country whose holidays abroad seem to be about taking Britain with them - and who may not respect the indigenous cultures of the countries they are visiting - which I wouldn't particularly want to be associated with.

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#44749 - 25/01/09 12:24 PM Re: Change [Re: fiffeshni]
Dr.BongoBingo Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/10/08
Posts: 46
Originally Posted By: fiffeshni
Someone has used the word coloured,what a big deal,as usual,the comment was misconstrued as being used in a negative way by the author when he was clearly praising Obama.


Sir/Madam

Allow me to help tighten your own grip over this matter.

With respect, I think you have misconstrued the posts.

Nobody suggested that Mark,per se,was being offensive. The response was merely an enquiry as to the validity of that particular word to describe an ethnic race.
And since you state that it's all about "intent" I assume that you agree with the dormant possibility of it being an inappropriate word.


Quote:

I have never been referred to as a coloured b****d in my life,but if someone refers to me as a coloured guy,why should I find that offensive?


How could I possibly answer that ? It's for an individual to cultivate their own repertoire of offense.
However, if a complete stranger, with a hateful countenance, addressed you as a "coloured b*****d", how would you gauge the intent ? Offensive ?

Kind Regards
Dr.BB

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#44753 - 25/01/09 03:35 PM Re: Change [Re: Bliss 60]
Mark Bradshaw Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/10/08
Posts: 238
Originally Posted By: Bliss 60
Originally Posted By: Lounge Lizard
Yes, it's all about what group do or don't mind being called.
We don't mind Brits, Australians don't mind Aussies but Pakistanis do mind Paki and Blacks don't like Coloured.


Sorry if people think I need to get a grip on this, but hey - I think this is an important issue. I don't for one minute think that Nimrod meant anything by the use of the word "coloured", and as far as I can tell, he's a good person who wouldn't mean to cause anyone offence. So my comments on the word were not particularly directed at him, but I do actually make a point of pointing out that the use of the word "coloured" can be offensive to some black people. I think that there are two reasons for this:

a) it was the word used by deeply racist people in the deep south of america when black people were being heavily oppressed.

b) saying that someone is "coloured" suggests that they have some "colour" added to what is the standard or normal skin colour - ie. in the minds of those who originated the phrase - the white skin (or as it should be - the pinky/yellow/red/brown skin with the odd freckle thrown in - who exactly is the "coloured" person?)

Similarly as Mr LL points out - "paki" is an offensive term, because it was and is used by racists to denigrate all people of south asian origin.

I guess that the terms Brit and Aussie are OK because they haven't been used in a derogatory fashion ever, although - whilst I'm not going to make a meal of it - I probably would do a double take if someone called me a Brit - because I'd be worried that it's main usage might be something like "Brits abroad" - ie. the seemingly large body of people from our country whose holidays abroad seem to be about taking Britain with them - and who may not respect the indigenous cultures of the countries they are visiting - which I wouldn't particularly want to be associated with.


Thank you for everyone sticking up for me. A word wrong - apologies.
Nimrod

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#44756 - 25/01/09 05:34 PM Re: Change [Re: Mark Bradshaw]
Slogger Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/06/05
Posts: 2892
Loc: West Lancs.
Mark,
I dont think you should apologise. I do not see anything wrong with the way you expressed your post, in the context that it was made.
Dave.

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#44769 - 26/01/09 12:38 PM Re: Change [Re: Slogger]
Mark Bradshaw Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/10/08
Posts: 238
Anyway,I President Barack Obama all the best in the world. He has a tall order to meet,but he has the energy and will to face it. I just wish we had someone like him.
Nimrod

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