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#53027 - 04/01/10 05:02 PM Two fairly dumb questions - Ennerdale YH and poles
Gamebird Offline
Full Member

Registered: 28/12/09
Posts: 43
Loc: North Yorks
1. How far is it (miles/hours) from St. Bee's to Ennerdale YH? I am having great trouble working this out (told you it was a dumb question!). I know it is a good bit further than Ennerdale Bridge but various maps and website have it as anything from a couple of miles to two hours. I was planning to get the Sherpa bus from Richmond to St Bee's on the morning I start my walk but it doesn't get in until 10am which I fear might be leaving it a bit late to set off for Ennerdale YH.

2. Poles? The first question anyone asks when I tell them that I'm doing the C2C is 'are you going to be carrying those daft poles?'. Am I? I have no idea. Previous walking experience (barring a few Munroes as a kid) is a couple of miles round the block with the dogs for which I feel no need to drag poles with me. Pros and cons plese (other than, obviously, looking like an idiot and leaving them behind every time I sit down).

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#53028 - 04/01/10 05:51 PM Re: Two fairly dumb questions - Ennerdale YH and poles [Re: Gamebird]
DodgeyKnee Offline
Full Member

Registered: 22/07/09
Posts: 109
Loc: London
St. Bees to Ennerdale YH, you're looking at 21 miles.

I'd guess including stops you'll have to average over 2 1/2 miles/hour. What about Cleator?

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#53029 - 04/01/10 06:52 PM Re: Two fairly dumb questions - Ennerdale YH and poles [Re: DodgeyKnee]
Stottie Offline
Full Member

Registered: 21/02/07
Posts: 568
Loc: Derbyshire, England
Forgive my bluntness, but the fact you ask such questions clearly shows you should not contemplate walking from St Bees to Ennerdale YH in one day.

You might succeed, even if you start as late as 10am, but it's a long way for a first day for almost every walker, even experienced ones. Next day you won't feel like walking anywhere.

Constructively (if you are still with me) I suggest you get out regularly for a good walk and learn how to navigate using map and compass. You'll soon find out whether you need poles.
_________________________
Pete

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#53030 - 04/01/10 07:14 PM Re: Two fairly dumb questions - Ennerdale YH and poles [Re: Stottie]
slowcoach Offline
Full Member

Registered: 30/07/09
Posts: 1925
Loc: Yorkshire
Poles are vey much a matter of individual preference and what suits one person might be an almighty hindrance to another.

If you do decide to invest in poles have a look at "Pacerpoles". They have a website. My wife bought a pair to aid her recovery after a leg operation and what a difference they made. They have shaped handles which relieves a lot of weight off the knees ... which is what she wanted.

I use Leki shock absorbing ones which personally I find indispensable over rough ground, but I confess, on my solo days in the high fells, I "borrow" hers.

The best way forward is to either borrow a pair from your friends for a practice or buy a very cheap pair from Tesco (other shops are available) and try them. If you find you can't get on with them you have lost little, if you find them helpful pay a visit to the Altberg factory at Richmond (I see you are from North Yorkshire)and try out the Pacerpoles.

Try also the poles with the "positive" handle. These have slightly angled handles which mirror the angle of you wrist. You may, or may not, find this small difference quite useful.

You certainly won't look an idiot carrying them ... they are an accepted part of the walking armoury nowadays, though perhaps not in Bettys

PS Are you called Gamebird because you are always grousing? Or is it because ..... no, I won't go that direction!

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#53033 - 04/01/10 07:39 PM Re: Two fairly dumb questions - Ennerdale YH and poles [Re: slowcoach]
Gamebird Offline
Full Member

Registered: 28/12/09
Posts: 43
Loc: North Yorks
Ahhh, the Gamebird moniker comes from another (non-walking related) forum which I thought I'd stick to as it means that a)I will remember my login details fairly easily and b)anyone that knows me already will know who I am. If you really must know it comes from a day out walking with a female friend when we passed through a gate with a sign on which read 'Gamebirds this way, strictly no dogs'. Sort of stuck after that....

Thank you very much for the pole advice - if I have a weak link it may be my knees (not a serious problem but have prevented me from achieving marathon running ambitions; they hold up pretty well to hill-walking). I may try some out.

Stottie your bluntness is forgiven and your advice appreciated and heeded, but despite my flippancy I am reasonably well into a fairly hefty training program and I know my way fairly well round a map and compass. I have a few shortish days immediately after day 1 so I may just plough on on the first day. I think I will set off a lot earlier than 10am however so may have to arrive in St. Bee's a day early.

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#53034 - 04/01/10 08:26 PM Re: Two fairly dumb questions - Ennerdale YH and poles [Re: Gamebird]
Geo Offline
Full Member

Registered: 19/09/05
Posts: 399
Loc: Oamaru, New Zealand
Originally Posted By: Gamebird


2. Poles? The first question anyone asks when I tell them that I'm doing the C2C is 'are you going to be carrying those daft poles?'. Am I? I have no idea. Previous walking experience (barring a few Munroes as a kid) is a couple of miles round the block with the dogs for which I feel no need to drag poles with me. Pros and cons plese (other than, obviously, looking like an idiot and leaving them behind every time I sit down).


Hi Gamebird,
Don't use them myself as I tend to find them a hassle to carry and also luckily as yet don't have any knee problems.
(most of the hiking I do in my location is in steep 'bushed' areas so I tend to just grab a bit of dead wood to use as a temporary pole if at all needed for steep downhill bits. I came across this article that may be of some interest to you. I'd heard that using poles burns more calories (which could be a factor in long distance food supply) but folk obviously seem to benefit from the 'support' that poles give to joints.
Below is the article from besttrekkingpoles.com...

Does using walking sticks or trekking poles conserve energy as some claim? Ray Jardine, one of the earliest promoters of ultralight backpacking, pointed out years ago that carrying more weight in the form of walking sticks has to take more energy. It's basic physics. He recommended going without. Now recent scientific research has proven him right - sort of.

A study done at James Madison University in Virginia found that people who used walking sticks or trekking poles while hiking increased their heart rate and burned more calories. The hikes were in a variety of terrains.

This was meant as a health study, though, not backpacking research. They found improved lung capacity in those who used walking sticks. Subjects increased their fitness level without any perceived increase in exertion, according to researchers.

Okay, time to read between the lines and apply this to lightweight backpacking. Is it worth using those trekking poles or not? If you reread the above information you'll realize that there is more energy spent when using them, but that users don't notice. So Jardine was right about the basic physics of the situation after all.

But the fact that users don't perceive an increase in exertion is important. Why don't they? It seems likely that it's because the use of the poles is spreading the expenditure of energy more evenly between their various muscle groups. Take some of the weight with your arms and chest and you spare your legs some of their work. That seems logical.

Of course we have already known that whether or not the extra weight causes us to spend more energy for the same number of miles hiked, walking sticks can save our knees. And even if we use more energy to do so, we might be able to go more miles more comfortably if we spare the joints the abuse. So Jardine may not be right about the value of getting rid of the trekking poles.

It seems that some people should be using trekking poles, while some should go without them. Those who have weak ankles or knees might benefit, in other words, while those who don't have these problems and want to backpack more miles on the fewer calories probably will do better without.

This also suggests that there may be better and worse times for using walking sticks. For example, you might do best to save your energy and arms when hiking long level stretches. Meanwhile you should get the poles out for downhill stretches where you can spread out the exertion among your muscle groups.
_________________________
Dances With Marmots

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#53036 - 04/01/10 08:50 PM Re: Two fairly dumb questions - Ennerdale YH and poles [Re: Geo]
Harland Online   content
Full Member

Registered: 29/04/05
Posts: 1339
Loc: North Yorkshire
I must admit to thinking that people used walking poles to "be with it" and I never used them; in fact I was actively against them.

For the last 2 weeks of a 630 mile South West Coast Path walk I couldn't go up or down steps if I tried to use my left leg first. The knee had become too week. I think that walking down hills/steps in the cliff paths without taking a lot of care had put too much pressure on my knee.

On balance therefore I would recommend taking a pole to help getting down steep hills as this is where previously I just didn't take enough care. It may be worth using them before your knees/hips get knackered!
_________________________
Pennine Way 2005&2014;C2C 2006;SWCP 2007;WHW 2008;GGW 2008; Dales Way 2011;Clev.W 2012;Yorkshire W.W. 2012;Offa's Dyke 2013;Peddars Way & Norfolk Coast Path 2014;Pembrokeshire Coast Path 2015;LEJoG 2018;Camino 2019;2020 NOTHING!2021 Hopefully.

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#53037 - 04/01/10 09:34 PM Re: Two fairly dumb questions - Ennerdale YH and poles [Re: Geo]
Gamebird Offline
Full Member

Registered: 28/12/09
Posts: 43
Loc: North Yorks
Thanks Oamaru, I did some trekking in South Island (and indeed have visted Oamaru!) after uni. I like the scientific approach! It would seem that poles would help me down hill (which I find hard going) but only if they are worth the consequent energy expenditure to carry them uphill! I took an ash stake on a walk up the Matukituki Valley and found it helped so I think that the answer is to buy a cheap pair and give them a try whilst training and see what I think. I guess I'm highly unlikely to be spotted by anyone I know and laughed at....

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#53040 - 05/01/10 12:11 AM Re: Two fairly dumb questions - Ennerdale YH and poles [Re: Gamebird]
Reluctanttrucker Offline
Full Member

Registered: 26/09/09
Posts: 738
Loc: Earth. Usually,but not exclusi...
Originally Posted By: Gamebird
Thanks Oamaru, I did some trekking in South Island (and indeed have visted Oamaru!) after uni. I like the scientific approach! It would seem that poles would help me down hill (which I find hard going) but only if they are worth the consequent energy expenditure to carry them uphill! I took an ash stake on a walk up the Matukituki Valley and found it helped so I think that the answer is to buy a cheap pair and give them a try whilst training and see what I think. I guess I'm highly unlikely to be spotted by anyone I know and laughed at....

I just bought a pair at Go Outdoors for 6 quid.
If I can't get on with them, it's six quid.
If I can and they work for me,then it's worth trying out.
They are "High Gear",and at that price, where is the downside?
I tried them at the weekend and I have no aches and pains, even thoughbit's 6 weeks since my last exertion.
On balance,they seem to work.(For now)
_________________________
Next one.
June 5th 2016.
The Fifth anniversary of C2C1
Yup Mad as hatters.


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#53042 - 05/01/10 01:26 AM Re: Two fairly dumb questions - Ennerdale YH and poles [Re: Reluctanttrucker]
flatlands Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 496
Hello, Flatlands is back and planning a 7th crossing of the Coast to Coast walk (east to west) sometime in June this year.
St. Bees to Ennerdale Yh or Gillerthwaite as it is known, 21 miles, there are short-cuts. Miss out the cliff walk and Dent and go the north shore path of the Ennerdale lake on a superb path/track. That would make it 14 miles.

Poles, there are great for flagging knees and I had them on my 2009 walk, only I was camping every night. If I was on the felt terrain, I would fasten up the 2 poles with velco tape and attach them to my rucksack. You can use a long strap also, mine are Leki and have seized up. Next time, a cheap apir from Go-Outdoors.

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